Not at all remotely symbolic

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TOPIC: Not at all remotely symbolic

#665408

Bruno
Posts: 12599

posted 16-05-2012 14:50

Bored of Education wrote:

To be fair, he is talking about a time when it was suggested that it was a case of when Chelsea would stop winning the EPL with their limitless funds rather than if. It all went awry as they realised the good players and good management have something to do with it rather than just chucking money at the problem a la Real

Anyone who thought that obviously wasn't thinking entirely clearly. But of course Chelsea are still competing with a few other clubs with bags of money. As someone here said you don't need infinite money, you just need enough.

In as much as Chelsea have effectively limitless funds to spend on players, they virtually guarantee themselves a permanent place near the top of the table. I'd say this season is an outlier: they were 2nd last year, 1st the year before that, 3rd in 08-09, 2nd in 07-08, 2nd in 06-70, etc. (And this season they stand to win Europe, which will negate their unusual failure to qualify for CL.)

And in as much as other clubs don't, the inverse applies. That's all you can say really.

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#665413

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 16-05-2012 14:54 Not having followed it closely this year, is the assumption that Chelsea put their real energies into the Champions League rather than the EPL this year, a la Milan a few years back?
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#665417

Calvert
Scorched earth the policy The reason for the siege
Posts: 3096

posted 16-05-2012 15:04

Calvert, got me there with the new Bourne movie. But at some point, somewhere, there will be something that you like or find useful that will have been touched by oligarch money. That's all I'm saying. I will not be swayed that I should not be happy that Man City won by their owners. There was 27 pages of it in this thread so far, and about 2700 threads so far over the past few years. I've heard everything there could possibly be heard, and I am still happy that Man City won. They were fun to watch, they did not overtly cheat their way to the title, and they have a somewhat nice bunch of fans. (It also takes me back to living in the Lower East Side, when my friend got New Music Express and I'd read about the Oasis-Blur wars and see the Man City shirt on Noel.)

.

J.V., i'm not trying to talk you out of it, I'm as thrilled for some City supporting mates of mine as you are, indeed I'll be sending a bottle of Champagne to one later today, but be aware that quite a number of their somewhat nice fans have spent what seems like eternity bleating on about the 'Munichs' and wearing their victimhood of the last 40-odd years of mismanagement like a badge of honour.
For every Noel there's a Liam, that's all.

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#665422

Bored of Education
Expand shrimp and crab farming in brackish water
Posts: 16261

posted 16-05-2012 15:09

Not having followed it closely this year, is the assumption that Chelsea put their real energies into the Champions League rather than the EPL this year, a la Milan a few years back?

I don't think so. The timing of the change of manager suited scraping into the knock-out stages and then they were fine from then on in. The EPL was already irretrievable by the time AVB had departed.

Anyone who thought that obviously wasn't thinking entirely clearly.

I don't know. Who else had the money to compete. Of course, not only did Chelsea have enough money to buy the better players that they needed but to buy the players other teams wanted (apart from your figurehead players like Gerrard at Liverpool etc)

Last Edit: 16-05-2012 15:10:43 by Bored of Education.

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#665431

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 16-05-2012 15:24 Who else had the money to compete. The question answers itself. It's never been a case of not enough great players to go around. It's just a question of who is getting them and, more importantly, how much they're going for. If Chelsea made preemptive buying a practice, it obviously couldn't do that to the extent that no one else could compete.
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#665535

Harry Truscott
Posts: 15744

posted 16-05-2012 17:41

Brunislaw wrote:

Not having followed it closely this year, is the assumption that Chelsea put their real energies into the Champions League rather than the EPL this year, a la Milan a few years back?

No, it's that their aging core of key players can summon the strength and will to perform in the kind of concerted blasts required for cup football but not the nine month slog of the league.

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#665568

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 16-05-2012 18:44 So the reason they came in second last year is they were all a year younger?
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#665578

Harry Truscott Posts: 15744	posted 16-05-2012 18:56 That and they threw a chunk of the season away with power struggles between senior players and the initial manager this season would be the main factors, I'd guess. The decline's been pretty clear since the early winter of 10/11 because they started that season like a train, if I recall correctly.
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#665589

Calvert Scorched earth the policy The reason for the siege Posts: 3096	posted 16-05-2012 19:14 In other shock news,Partice Evra is complete tool. The most positionally unaware defender in the universe claims that all United have to do is play well in every game next season and it'll be 'easy'. www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/artic...ys-Patrice-Evra.html
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#665618

satchmo76
Posts: 1528

posted 16-05-2012 20:42

Donbas Ogrodnik wrote:

The season broken into two halves (hinrunde and ruckrunde as they're known in Germany). Stats courtesy of kicker.de, from a idea of Jimmy Bignutz's.

1 Manchester City 14 3 2 45
2 Manchester United 14 3 2 45
3 Tottenham Hotspur 13 3 3 42
4 Arsenal 11 3 5 36
5 Chelsea 10 4 5 34
6 Liverpool 9 7 3 34
7 Newcastle United 8 6 5 30
8 Stoke City 7 5 7 26
9 Everton 7 3 9 24
10 Aston Villa 5 8 6 23
11 Norwich City 5 7 7 22
12 West Bromwich Albion 6 4 9 22
13 Sunderland 5 6 8 21
14 Fulham 4 8 7 20
15 Swansea City 4 8 7 20
16 Wolverhampton Wanderers 4 5 10 17
17 Queens Park Rangers 4 5 10 17
18 Wigan Athletic 3 6 10 15
19 Blackburn Rovers 3 5 11 14
20 Bolton Wanderers 4 1 14 13

1 Manchester City 14 2 3 44
2 Manchester United 14 2 3 44
3 Newcastle United 11 2 6 35
4 Arsenal 10 4 5 34
5 Everton 8 8 3 32
6 Fulham 10 2 7 32
7 Chelsea 8 6 5 30
8 Wigan Athletic 8 4 7 28
9 Tottenham Hotspur 7 6 6 27
10 Swansea City 8 3 8 27
11 Norwich City 7 4 8 25
12 West Bromwich Albion 7 4 8 25
13 Bolton Wanderers 6 5 8 23
14 Queens Park Rangers 6 2 11 20
15 Stoke City 4 7 8 19
16 Liverpool 5 3 11 18
17 Sunderland 6 6 7 18
18 Blackburn Rovers 5 2 12 17
19 Aston Villa 2 9 8 15
20 Wolverhampton Wanderers 1 5 13 8

Puts Kenny's sacking into context.

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#665651

NHH
Quite a nice South African
Posts: 2289

posted 16-05-2012 22:17

Tab wrote:

However something like this isn't going to really be possible until you have a rigid breakeven rule, because until then everyone is going to think that they could be the next club to do a man city, not enough clubs are going to want to split the CL money if they think it could be them as one of the big four.

It's only when the prospect of magical advancement has disappeared, will clubs start to realise what is in their best interests.

The mad, swivel eyed United obsessive, city-hating myopic cunt has,er, alighted on the reasoning why progressive forces in Europe have backed FFP so strongly, with the clear recognition that it has to be the first step, rather than the destination. Must be that stopped clock being right occasionally then.

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#665657

jasoñ voorhees
Posts: 7615

posted 16-05-2012 22:44

TAB, thank you for your reply.

However, Ferguson railing against violent thugs in 1993 was leading up to 1999. That was in the good of the game, as English football was American football.

However, by the time Arsene Wenger decided to beat him at his own game by playing even more beautifully, his mouthing off went from "good of the game" to "horseshit to win games by any costs."

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#665686

The Awesome Berbaslug!!!
Posts: 16518

posted 17-05-2012 00:32

However, Ferguson railing against violent thugs in 1993 was leading up to 1999. That was in the good of the game, as English football was American football.

Jason I think you have seriously missed my point. in 1993, man utd made the LA raiders look like a bunch of "cissy bitches". In fact, that's what they would have called them if they met them out on the town because of their reliance on armour. That and they liked fighting.

when even your goalkeeper and your attacking playmaker are feared throughout the league, you know you have a little problem. And ferguson had to defend some fresh atrocity every fortnight or so, and he said a lot of questionable things.

But ferguson to his credit realized that this had only a limited future, and had already started to move away from this before Eric Cantona went, er, a little overboard. He had already signed andy Cole to replace Hughes, and cleared the way for a considerably more mild mannered bunch of players from the youth team to make the step up.

His job with the media became a hell of a lot easier as a result. He no longer had to do things like try and professionally destroy jimmy hill, because he criticized eric cantona for kicking some norwich guy in the head.

nothing you have seen from ferguson over the last decade has come close to what he was like between 92 and 95. Maybe you will understand this reference a bit better than garcia, who utterly failed, but in an awful lot of ways, Alex ferguson is an awful lot like tony soprano. But with chunks of Michael Corleone from Godfather III.

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#665698

Bruno
Posts: 12599

posted 17-05-2012 01:55

The Awesome Berbaslug!!! wrote:

in 1993, man utd made the LA raiders look like a bunch of "cissy bitches". In fact, that's what they would have called them if they met them out on the town because of their reliance on armour.

One of those cissy bitches

Hmm, if the 1993 Red Devils and the 1993 Raiders got into a fight, who would win? One look at this

would surely be all it would take.

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#665701

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 17-05-2012 02:20 Some NFL players without their armor (just for fun - I doubt anyone needed reminding)
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#665706

The Awesome Berbaslug!!! Posts: 16518	posted 17-05-2012 02:53 Look how tough and dangerous they are with their armour and their guns. I bet they wouldn't be so tough after 15 pints. Let's see how brave they are when paul parker is kneeing them in the face.
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#665708

ursus arctos Posts: 26641	posted 17-05-2012 03:02 This is good. You're up to bargaining.
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#665712

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 17-05-2012 03:30
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#665729

Bored of Education Expand shrimp and crab farming in brackish water Posts: 16261	posted 17-05-2012 08:40 10 years after Cantona retired?
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#665796

Bruno Posts: 12599	posted 17-05-2012 11:46 Bored of Education wrote: 10 years after Cantona retired? Well, I needed something that conveyed how philosophical he is.
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