QUOTE:
"you won't get Budgie Bird and Charlie Endell ripping you off".

I don't know what that means.


I agree that a lot of women go into the various arms of the porn/sex trade for the money but, in America at least, there's also a bizarre obsession with fame that seems to cross all class and ethnic boundaries. As the reality TV fad has shown, there's no shortage of people who will do literally anything to get their face on TV, even if it's really degrading and will bring shame on them and their family. Compared to some reality programs, doing porn or dancing at a titty bar is much more dignified.

Of course, some of those women hope or believe that porn will be an entre into a "real" career of somekind - acting, popstar, whatever. That's probably a delusion anyway, but it seems that a lot of people who do these sorts of things believe whatever fame, attention or notoriety they get from it is the end in itself.

Old TV reference, Reed.

Here are the rather fine opening credits: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nCsYKzoPQfU

QUOTE:
The classiness element is just a way of saying "you won't get Budgie Bird and Charlie Endell ripping you off".

That's it - in a nutshell, even if it's drifting further towards the lapdancing side of things and away from the Heff.

It's on two levels that it operates: the trappings of class, wealth and sophistication, which is there to encourage you that there'll be no riff-raff who are likely to glass you; and also, because there's the aura of money it kind of suggests that they pay enough to persuade even posh birds to get their kit off for you, not just a bunch of crack whores trying to find money to buy drugs and SMA gold. It's just an exaggerated version of the fact that Jamies winebars in the City pay the highest wages so they get the best-looking and most personable bar staff. So, you know, if you do establish a deep emotional bond and discover a shared love of the music of Gorecky while she's shoving her tits within an inch of your face then you wouldn't be ashamed to take her home to meet your parents. Which to be blunt is all 90% of us have ever wanted out of life.

And yes, Wyatt, it is all a bit sordid, but you know, I quite like a bit of sordidity from time to time. The main reason I don't have any interest in going to these places is that the night's only ever going to end up with a furtive wank at home and that can be executed without having to fork out about £150 and endure the jostling and beery mateyness of a bunch of loutish city boys, however well-schooled, moneyed and unlikely to glass one they may be. I wouldn't go to a restaurant where I wasn't allowed to eat the food, either.

You're an adult with his own place, right? No need to wank furtively then.

Wyatt Earp wrote:

QUOTE:
I dunno. If PPV thinks you're a perve, you're in trouble.

Forget nakid' birds.
I'm mostly pissed off that the women of OTF haven't mustered even the slightest hint of giving Wyatt a life-time achievement award for... I dunno, you know, repeatedly speaking on your behalf, twice a day, thrice on every even numbered date.

The man's such a beacon for us all.

It's getting creepy, Wyatt. It's like you think you know exactly what every woman in the world wants, when none of us really do. They're not one and the same, no matter how linguistically perfect you try to explain it. They're individuals. Sat next to one, she might have experienced a crap sex life, sat next to another she might be turned on by a good (controlled) whipping. Deal with it, grampa Simpson!

You’ve made it a mission to mock me when I’ve expressed admiration here with anything related about the opposite sex. You’ve found, probably, delight in that you can point a stern and Amish-like finger at someone like me and be the proud John Stuart Mill of OTF.

Don’t you ever put “perve” next to my name, ever again!

I know how to treat a woman. You don’t know me!

QUOTE:
You're an adult with his own place, right? No need to wank furtively then.

There is if your place is also populated by your wife and children.

In that case, you shouldn't be out at a titty bar.

Take a fucking joke, PPV.

PG: don't get me wrong, I'm not against a bit of sordidity either. Neither am I saying it really is sordid, actually. I am speculating, though, that the guys who patronise the chrome and plush end of the striptease market are, some of them, at some level, seeking to convince themselves they're "classy", and that they're doing that because at some level, they are worried about sordidness.

My experience of striptease has been pretty down-and-dirty, actually: the Peel, and a similar place in Vauxhall. I can't claim I got nothing out of it (not without lying, I can't; you can't really ignore the evidence when it's busy revealing to you how uncomfortably ill-tailored at the front are your off-the-peg trousers). I did kind of feel that the beauty of the women rather threw into relief the ugliness of me and my fellow punters. Does that make sense? But there was an honesty to it that I suspect to be lacking at your "Gentlemans' Clubs".

PPV, notice that it's men, not women, that I'm arrogantly claiming to understand here.

It's got precisely fuck all to do with 'what women want', as well.

I think "John Stuart Mill's Stern and Amish-like Finger" exceeds the letter count, which is a pity, because I feel a change of name coming on.

Wyatt Earp wrote:

QUOTE:
Take a fucking joke, PPV.

Take a fucking break from dipping into every single thread about women where I've posted and post a smug comment about what I'm saying, and we'll both be fine and dandy.

And you need permission from me to use that name, anyway.

I don't want a brawl with you, but it's bloody disturbing, this outspoken concern here that I'm some, well, I won't even try to summarize the comments.

The jokes don't work, OK?

Well, maybe not, but they'd stand a better chance if you got the point of them. People were saying that Hefner got off lightly; the joke was that far from that being the case, even you, who like to talk about the laydeez and their charms as much as anyone, wouldn't go as far as to indulge him. I think that's a pretty mild dig as digs go.

I know what women want.
But i am keeping it to myself as i like staying ahead of the game.

As for stripclubs, i don't like them and have always felt uncomfortable inside such establishments.

Oh, and strippers aint that good in bed, trust me.
And married men who go to stripclubs are pathetic.

Have we had any "Women of OTF" awards? Just a thought