Just watching the penalties from Brazil vs France from the quarter-finals of Mexico '86 and was wondering whether anyone could tell me if Bellone's 3rd penalty for France should've been discounted?

Basically he hits the post and the ball is coming out of the goal but hits the Brazilian keeper and rebounds in, you can see it here about 5.30mins in, surely in a penalty shoot-out the ball goes dead if it hits the post and rebounds back towards the penalty taker doesn't it?

Aaaah, just found this on the ever reliable Wikipedia;

QUOTE:
A controversial decision in the 1986 World Cup led to the "Madrid rule" clarification of the penalty procedure. In the quarter-final shootout between Brazil and France, Bruno Bellone's kick rebounded out off the post and back into the goal off goalkeeper Carlos's back. Referee Ioan Igna gave the goal to France, and Brazil captain Edinho was booked for protesting that the kick should have been considered a miss as soon as it rebounded off the post. In 1987, Rule 14, covering penalty kicks, was clarified to support Igna's decision

I think that in penalty shootouts the rule is that the taker is allowed one shot and one shot only (they can't score if the keeper saves but it comes back to them, like ni normal play). But if in a shootout the keeper deflects the ball into the net, or decides in a moment of madness to throw it in, or whatever, I'd guess then yes it must be a "goal" in a penalty shootout. The ball can presumably only be declared "dead" when the only other player on the pitch who can legally touch it - the keeper - can say to the referee "no, it's a dead ball".

As an aside, two things from that shootout.

1. What naive times they were. The goalkeepers actualy staying on their line - indeed, not even moving! - nutil the ball was struck. Most of those penalties just went straight down the middle.

2. An early example of the maxim that the best players miss the pens. Socrates and - in a John Terry moment - Michel Platini himself. I'd forgotten that.

Didn't Zico miss a penalty in normal time, as well, to put Brazil 2-1 up, or have I misremembered that? It's been excised from this particular highlights clip.

It was Michel Platini's birthday on the day of that game.

Zico missed, I've got the video of the Official Fifa Flim, Hero, and every time I see that penalty shootout I hear the background music.

I remember that I wanted France to win. I can still remember Luis Fernandez disappearing off the screen whilst he ran around the pitch.